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Player's Handbook reversed art, different print version?
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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 1:02 pm 
 

I was perusing through several copies of the Player's Handbook I have, and I noticed that in one, the art on Page 108 was reversed or flipped. (The torch-carrying and shield-wielding dwarf on the left now appears on the right).

The interesting thing is that the art is reversed in one of the two copies of the PHB that appear to be the same print versions.  They are 7th prints according to the Acaeum chart (Wizard logo on Trampier-art cover, ISBN on spine, states 6th printing on title page, white endpapers/flyleaves).

I did a couple of searches on the forums and google, but I didn't see anything mentioning this. I wonder if one of these is actually another print of the PHB before the 8th print (TSR face logo).

Does anyone have a TSR face logo version that they could compare and verify if the art is reversed?

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 2:54 pm 
 

misterspock wrote:I was perusing through several copies of the Player's Handbook I have, and I noticed that in one, the art on Page 108 was reversed or flipped. (The torch-carrying and shield-wielding dwarf on the left now appears on the right).

After going through seven PHBs, I thought maybe you were just yankin' my chain.  But there it is, on book #8.  Very interesting find! :D

Mine's a 7th as well.  Just a guess, but I'd suggest that perhaps that within the 7ths, the reversed one came first, and was "corrected".  It might well be the first "Random House" printing, I don't recall if they were the publisher before the 7th or not.

I think you might be the first person to note that particular distinction, but we already knew there were some printing variants in and around the 7th.  This thread might have some useful things to compare:

viewtopic.php?p=71901

I'm sorry, I don't own an 8th.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 5:16 pm 
 

I have a regular 7th print and the variant as well.  Both of my 8th prints have the sword wielding dwarf on the left.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 7:28 pm 
 

Looking through my prints I do not have one with the artwork on the right hand page.


Sixth matches the current acaeum description:
 
Wizard logo
Cover art is of two thieves prying the gems out of a large demon idol
"Advanced D&D" is in a yellow angled banner on top left, with "Players Handbook" (in yellow lettering) centered towards the top
ISBN now on spine
Endpapers and flyleaves are orange
States "6th Printing, January 1980" on copyright page


Sixth plus (+) matches the current 7th print description:


Wizard logo
Cover art is of two thieves prying the gems out of a large demon idol
"Advanced D&D" is in a yellow angled banner on top left, with "Players Handbook" (in yellow lettering) centered towards the top
ISBN on spine
Endpapers and flyleaves are white
Still states "6th Printing, January 1980" on copyright page


Seventh print (new) matches the 7th above with these differences:

-page 127 is now numbered
-page 127 has the newer catalog. Modules up to A1-A4 are listed and B1,B2 are listed on next page.
-pages 123-124 and pages 125-126 still state (these pages are perforated for easy removal if desired).


Seventh plus (+) matches the (new) 7th print above except:

-pages 123-124 and pages 125-126 no longer have the "perforated for easy removal" statement.
**the "tall" book I have matches this description**



I agree with Deimos and guess this new print would come between the 6th and 6th+ of the above listings. Great find!
Anyone have one they want to part with?

Mike


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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 7:48 pm 
 

The artwork is not on the right hand page - it is still on the left hand page.

The difference is that the artwork itself has been misprinted.  The image is printed in reverse with respect to the x axis.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 8:30 pm 
 

I'll try to get some photos posted soon so everyone can see.

By the way, I wonder why the artist's initials aren't on that particular piece, or at least I didn't see them if they're hidden.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:43 pm 
 

Mars wrote:The artwork is not on the right hand page - it is still on the left hand page.

The difference is that the artwork itself has been misprinted.  The image is printed in reverse with respect to the x axis.


:oops:  I'm blaming the pain meds  :oops:

I will have another look shortly.


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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:58 pm 
 

Ok I do have one with the torch bearer with the shield on the left instead of the right.
It is in the 7th+ print listed above. Do your copies match the 7th or 7th+?


Mike

*edit - I just noticed the "players handbook" on the spine is white instead of yellow.


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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:18 pm 
 

Both of my copies (with reverse image and without) are 7th + printings.  They both have a very yellow "Player's Handbook" on the spine as well.

Also, my reverse image PH cover seems darker than the regular one and the location of the book opening crease is different as well.  The book opening crease of the reverse image PH is at about 1.1 cm or through the 2 of "2010".  The regular version PH it occurs at 1.3 cm of through the 1 of "2010".

Is this similar to your copies?

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:32 pm 
 

misterspock wrote:
By the way, I wonder why the artist's initials aren't on that particular piece, or at least I didn't see them if they're hidden.

Mike.


D. A. Trampier and Sutherland are the only artists listed on the title page, and that piece looks like a Trampier (aka DAT aka Tramp).

It covers 100% of page 108. The original was probably slightly larger and was cropped at the edges, removing the sig (if present).

I have a 7th print, but not the new variant in question.


Last edited by Zenopus on Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:32 pm 
 

Also, my reverse image PH cover seems darker than the regular one and the location of the book opening crease is different as well. The book opening crease of the reverse image PH is at about 1.1 cm or through the 2 of "2010". The regular version PH it occurs at 1.3 cm of through the 1 of "2010".


Mine matches this as well. Also my reverse image PH is slightly taller and narrower than the others.

Here are some images:

Image

Image

Image

It is the center one.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:37 pm 
 

I never noticed the tiny pair of eyes looking up the stairway at the halfling!

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:44 pm 
 

chromaticknight wrote:Ok I do have one with the torch bearer with the shield on the left instead of the right.
It is in the 7th+ print listed above. Do your copies match the 7th or 7th+?


Mike

*edit - I just noticed the "players handbook" on the spine is white instead of yellow.


Mine also matches the photos and your listing for 7+ print:

-page 127 is numbered
-page 127 has the newer catalog. Modules up to A1-A4 are listed and B1,B2 are listed on next page.
-pages 123-124 and pages 125-126 do not have the "perforated for easy removal" statement.
-"Players Handbook" on the spine is also a lighter shade of yellow, but not white.

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 11:26 pm 
 

chromaticknight wrote:Also my reverse image PH is slightly taller and narrower than the others.


Mine is taller and narrower.

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Post Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 5:24 am 
 

Mars wrote:Mine is taller and narrower.

The dimensions are unique.  I'm pretty sure the "white" Player's Handbook lettering that some people have described is simply due to common fading of yellow ink; mine is as yellow as my other printings.

However, this is also the copy that was considered "greener" in the other thread.

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Post Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 10:01 am 
 

Whaddya know, I have one too. It conforms in all ways to the description of the 7th print on this site (wizard logo, white endpapers, etc.), and has the torch/shieldbearer dwarf on the left. The "Players Handbook" lettering on the spine is as yellow as that of my others, though.

  

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Post Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:15 pm 
 

deimos3428 wrote:The dimensions are unique.  I'm pretty sure the "white" Player's Handbook lettering that some people have described is simply due to common fading of yellow ink; mine is as yellow as my other printings.

However, this is also the copy that was considered "greener" in the other thread.


I would have to agree that the "white" is due to fading, but I cant explain why the rest of the spine isnt faded. Maybe just poor coverage at the time of printing.
Yes this was the "greener" copy from that other thread.

It is definitly another printing of the PHB. Any ideas on putting it into sequence with the rest? I would put it between the 7th and 7th+ above. Should we get into the 7th, 7th alpha, 7th beta numbering or try to rework the entire list. I guess it is ultimately up to Scott and the next update.

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Post Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:54 pm 
 

chromaticknight wrote:I would have to agree that the "white" is due to fading, but I cant explain why the rest of the spine isnt faded. Maybe just poor coverage at the time of printing.
Yes this was the "greener" copy from that other thread.

I've noticed in MMs that yellow ink tends to fade to white faster than other inks.  Red is next-fastest, turning yellow-ish.

It is definitly another printing of the PHB. Any ideas on putting it into sequence with the rest? I would put it between the 7th and 7th+ above. Should we get into the 7th, 7th alpha, 7th beta numbering or try to rework the entire list. I guess it is ultimately up to Scott and the next update.

I was under the impression it was the 7th+ (using your terminology, not Acaeum's)...is this not correct?  That is, are there 7th+ prints both with and without this inversion?  

If so, then we need to sort out the sequence again.

If not, this is just another feature of the 7th+ and no re-ordering is required.

 YIM  
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