I am compiling information for software that I have been writing (forever it seems) and was just checking what can be construed as 'core rules' with regards to 1st edition AD&D.  The PH and DMG obviously are.  Is MM1 considered 'core'?  Are all the other hardcovers considered supplementary?

I am just looking to finalize the distinction.

-Len

Don't forget Unearthed Arcana for 1E. It's an addition to the core rules, and certainly not supplementary...I couldn't have existed without it back when 1E was the game-to-play.

Considering the "three book" method that is OD&D... MM is a required book. So, PHB, DMG, and MM. Everything else is supplementary. But, looking at the 2e "core rules" CD product, it would be best to include all the supplemental options as well, but have it default to the three only.

smarmy1 wrote:Sounds like an interesting project.  Just out of curiousity, what features are you planning on supporting and what language are you using?

Actually, I have never used the Core Rules myself; however, BadMike uses the software to generates our character sheets for our online campaign.  The sheets are nicely formatted and contain tons of useful information.  Very impressive compared to the old notebook paper method I used back in the day!

Thanks in advance.

Is someone had tons and tons of spare times on their hands, they could retrofit the Core rules 2.0 back down to 1st edition. It would mean custom ruling and designing about 80% of the stuff, but it could be done.  I thought long and hard about doing it once but didn't want to invest a year of my life....but it could be done.  A very versatile program (cores rules 2.0), I use it almost everyday!

Mike B.

Badmike wrote:
Is someone had tons and tons of spare times on their hands, they could retrofit the Core rules 2.0 back down to 1st edition. It would mean custom ruling and designing about 80% of the stuff, but it could be done.  I thought long and hard about doing it once but didn't want to invest a year of my life....but it could be done.  A very versatile program (cores rules 2.0), I use it almost everyday!

Mike B.

Mike this is what I am currently doing...Taking what I think works in CR2.0 and leaving out what seems half-baked.  Character generation is what I am currently doing.  What is proving difficult (actually time consuming) is creating all the tables.  There are 415 spells in the 'core rules' which need to be entered into a database.  I am roughly half way through, doing 50 spells here and 25 there.  Spells and their accompanying stats are by far the largest amount of data which needs to be collated.

smarmy1 wrote:Sounds like an interesting project.  Just out of curiousity, what features are you planning on supporting and what language are you using?

Actually, I have never used the Core Rules myself; however, BadMike uses the software to generates our character sheets for our online campaign.  The sheets are nicely formatted and contain tons of useful information.  Very impressive compared to the old notebook paper method I used back in the day!

Thanks in advance.

Smarmy1, out of the gate, I am planning character, treasure, and encounter generation.  All of these will adhere to the 1st edition core rules set.   Later I will begin to add UA, OA, and other references.  It will be totally customizable with people being able to enter their own stuff.  Everything will be exportable so that it can be shared.  So when someone adds the Anti-Paladin class from Dragon #39, they could post the exported info for everyone else to use.  One of the nice parts (and I have this working in a prototype) is that when you print your character out, you can have any stats overlay a blank character sheet of your choosing.  For instance, I have a scanned in character sheet and using a crystal reports type approach, you can drag and drop stats anywhere on the image.  You can control font, color, and style.  I always hated a program that forced me to use 'their' character sheet when the one I created was 'so much better'.  Anyway, It is all being written in c# with (currently) access as the database.  Not sure if that won't change to mysql, sql express or something else.  I know this seems like a lot but one thing I have on my side is time.  I am in no rush, and by the time it is ready for public consumption, there will be only 5 of us 1st edition players left.   But seriously, it is progressing nicely, I do code for a living and I have a gameplan.

-Len

Len,

Sounds great and thanks for the information.  I particularly like the customization aspects you have planned especially the user-configurable character sheets and import capabilities.  One of the first things I did when I started playing again was develop form-type character sheets using the Adobe tools.  Very simplistic output, but it allowed me to control the layout.  

When do you think your application will be ready for testing?  I'm sure there are at least 5 or maybe 6 1st edition players who are interested in your project.     Also, if you need an alpha-tester, I would be more than happy to help.  Or if you would like some assistance with the coding or database grunt work, please let me know.  I too program in C#/C++ and am well-versed with both Crystal Reports and database programming and would gladly help.  Feel free to PM me if you would like to talk further.

Thanks again.

Wow, I am glad that there is some interest.  I started something a very long time ago and it spun out of control in terms on feature creep.  

http://www.acaeum.com/forum/about501.html

A module maker with a terrain generator which I spent about 6 months working on, and then came a job change and....well my exuberance was exhausted by building a new home, etc. End of excuses.  I built a project plan with targeted milestones and have kept it simple to start.  I have spent the last couple of weeks compiling data from the PHB and DMG so that I have something to work with.  The Character generator is almost done,  I need to put in the encumbrance calculator which you can turn on and off.  I will post screen shots.  It really is in pieces with proofs of concepts leading to real bolt on functionality.

-Len

When thinking about what rules are "core" rules for AD&D......

Watch out for Unearthed Arcana.  

That book was the first gong in the deathknell of 1st Edition AD&D.  It sent the game spinning out of control.  

Unearthed Arcana can logically be regarded not as an AD&D book but as the first book in 2nd Edition...and one of the main reasons the rules had to be fixed with a new edition.

All modules printed before Unearthed Arcana were out-dated as soon as it was published.  The extra rules for weapon specialization, new spells and new character classes (barbarian and cavalier) radically altered game balance.

Watch out for Oriental Adventures as well.  That book was really a brother to Unearthed Arcana.  Rules additions in Oriental Adventures included martial arts (which could be used by a clever player to build a monster character stack) and new fighter classes with special abilities.  

Probably the most glaring example of problems with incorporating Oriental Adentures would the the "bushi" class.  The bushi had all the abilities of a fighter, plus an armor class bonus and an experience point table much easier than the old fighter.  Why play a fighter anymore when one could be a bushi?

By starting as a monk and switching to bushi at second level, it was possible to build a fighter character who never had to sleep, had an impossible AC without wearing armor, moved incredibly fast and could stun opponents with his fists.

Don't get me wrong....Unearthed Arcana and Oriental Adventures were both cool books and I used them a lot.  They just belong in a different section of the zoo than the DMG, PH, MM, FF and MM2.