That is, I have been recently involved in another platform called catawiki - for other stuff. It is an auction house, where your lots are evaluated by an expert, and there is no possibility to snipe on auctions. Of course, there are costs involved in the sales, and the lots have minimum expected value (like 75 US$).
Would you be interested in using something like this or not?

rosenkav wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:That is, I have been recently involved in another platform called catawiki - for other stuff. It is an auction house, where your lots are evaluated by an expert, and there is no possibility to snipe on auctions. Of course, there are costs involved in the sales, and the lots have minimum expected value (like 75 US$).
Would you be interested in using something like this or not?

It is an interesting site, and I thank you for bringing it to my attention.  It is possible that some sellers will be interested in either buying or selling with this site.  There are several issues that strike me immediately.  First, the vast majority of auction items appear to be in Europe making shipping to the US quite expensive.  Shipping for something the size of a Players Handbook appears to be about $40.00.  Second, this European slant also significantly reduces the number of rpg auction sellers and buyers who would sell and buy their items on this site.  One of the key advantages for eBay is that it involves thousands, if not tens of thousands, of buyers and sellers of rpg items.  A quick search for rpg items pulled up very few auctions.  Even a search for Marvel comics pulled up only a couple dozen items, much of it art.  Third, the $75 threshhold for auction items is on the high side for most D&D collectibles.  I understand this auction site is for upscale, expensive items, and I also realize there are dozens of high end rpg collectibles worth over $75, but that's not a broad enough spectrum of items to make this auction site work for our hobby just yet in my opinion.  

There are likely other factors which limit this site's effectiveness as a selling platform, but the factors I mentioned alone are significant.  However, I suspect that if this web-site's popularity grows and the number of rpg sellers increase and collectibles increase significantly in value, it could be a major player in the buying a selling of rpgs.  eBay certainly has its issues, but I could not help but notice as I read some feedback on Catawiki, similar, eBay-like problems surfaced.  For example, someone complained of poor packing, and another complained about a missing shipment.  Just because someone is selling an expensive item, it doesn't mean they know how to pack it well or the Post Office suddenly ships things correctly.

I wish Catawiki well, and I might just look at some items for sale again in the future.  Maybe other people here will see things differently.  

Thanks rosenkav for bringing up that site. Cool checking it out. It's basically (and by that I mean exactly) a European version of the AuctionZip and Invaluable sites that are used by North American Auction Houses to have an online presence for their Local Auctions.

I sold a pretty nice comic book last year, and I used a local Auction House that the winner of it bought through Invaluable against pretty heavy local competition.  I had tried to sell it locally myself but just couldn't track down a buyer for it. I had many people asking why I wasn't selling it on eBay. The short story of that was even though I've bought on eBay for almost 20 years, I've never sold on there and didn't think it would be a good idea to start with a $1000+ comic book. I just kept visualizing it disappearing, an Insurance claim would be denied and I'd be out my money and my Book. Having an Auction House handle the money part and the pick up or delivery eased my mind that I wasn't just going to get ripped off with no recourse. The problem with Auction Houses (besides their much higher fees) is that they don't know how to sell a lot of things. Even if they potentially have buyers for it - if they don't handle a lot of it, they just don't know. I had to talk to several Auctioneers here before I found one that would even do it the way I wanted it done. If it was an older book, like an early Superman, that wouldn't have been a problem but mine was a Modern book. BTW The buyer of my Comic didn't trust the Auction House or the Post Office to get it to him and he flew here to pick it up. Not a lot of us have the ability to do that.

The same would be true for selling valuable RPGs through an Auction House with online presence. They won't know how to advertise it. So you'll probably have to go to every possible forum or the like and advertise it yourself, which probably isn't too hard. But why are you bothering with an Auction House that's going to take 15-40% of the money when you're doing most of the selling. Maybe for the same reason I did.

Actually Frank Mentzer is doing this right now and he'd be the way to go if you have higher dollar items to sell. But his audience is very limited compared to eBay. Those buyers are serious ones and I'd bet they pay more than the typical eBay buyer on some things.

My local comic / gaming store runs a local auction a few times a year for RPG items. The sellers only get store credit for the items that sell in the Auction which to me is absolutely stupid of the sellers (I call them Donors) to do that. But they had an OD&D OCE Box Set go right before I found out about it and some other early stuff. It's definitely worth checking out for the buyers like me.

I look through Craigslist every once in a while and never find RPG items that aren't crazy over priced, low grade and low value. There might be things worth buying on there from time to time but they probably get snatched up as soon as they are listed. I've used Craigslist for buying and selling many times. Great for selling a used truck or buying some used Appliances, but to sell RPGs - I just don't know. I have thought about doing a Wanted post on there and might do so at some point but I keep thinking it's going to be a wasted effort. I worked in a comic store for a while that actively bought collections, maybe 1 in 10 had something actually worth buying and almost everyone thinks their junk is priceless...

I'm in a Facebook Group that buy - sell - trades RPGs. I've not been happy with buying on there, similar problems as with eBay. Items not honestly described and poor packing. It seems very cliquish though and I feel disadvantaged as a buyer so I'll probably not buy on there any more. They have a Classifieds on here, anyone wants to chime in on how that has gone for them...

I think the thing with eBay is that there really is no reason for sellers to use any other site to sell on. The exception may be Mentzer's listings. There are a bunch of traditional long time eBay sellers jumping ship to Amazon or specialty selling sites like Mercari and do very well with it. I think it would be much tougher to do something similar because RPGs are just too niche compared to Books and Electronics or Designer Clothing respectively. If somebody did set it up, they'd need to be able to get a majority of the buyers and sellers from other venues to make it work and then without an intermediary to grade and package properly, it wouldn't be much different than eBay, would it? That intermediary would need to be paid for their time and effort - kind of what NKG already is to an extent.

To me the best way to do any deal is a person to person local sale. But we all don't live near each other for that to be possible. Maybe I should put a want list on here and see how it goes, wouldn't hurt I guess.

rosenkav wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:Unfortunately the world of collecting has recently been more and more divided in two - Europe and US.
I used to buy lots of stuff on ebay some years ago, and this now would be pretty much impossible.
But well, for higher margin and value things an auction site has a niche.
The pros and cons are represented by the presence of an auction house and an expert. They take 12,5% of the sale from the seller and 9% from the buyer, but they provide a sort of reliability and protection. Catawiki also resolves the issue about payments at the root. So, it is luke a mixed feeling.

I spend a lot of time on eBay UK, sellers there just happen to have things I'm looking for. Shipping can be tough though, if they don't have several items that I can win and combine shipping - it's not worth it to me very often.

Funny thing I've noticed is that eBay US will block me regularly from the Euro versions. I might see a few things that a seller has but not all. So I'll have to log into the applicable Euro eBay to have full access. Just happened on a Belgian Seller's listings - I could only see 30 of his 1200 listings until I logged into ebay.be

At least here in my State (Missouri) of the US. Different Auctioneers will run things completely differently from each other. A lot of times with no rhyme or reason that is readily apparent. Some Auctioneers will work for almost free if it is something they REALLY want to sell - something that will greatly add exposure to the other things that they are selling. The one I work for will do Coins and Bullion for 2% with no buyer's premium or sales tax, but the consignor will have to have at least $30,000 worth. But he specializes in coins and gets top dollar for them.

Well, good luck to you rosenkav. I hope you find the answers that you are looking for.

Well, as I work in marketing, especially digital, and I am quite inside the dot com business, my curiosity is as why there is no alternative to ebay.
What I am seeing is that the big horizontal businesses get clobbered up by more nimble and vertical specialized platforms.
So, it is part curiosity and part professional interest, if you catch my drift

Please excuse my disagreement with your comment aia. Not really a disagreement than just a different way that I look at it.

aia wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:This is why everybody here prefers ebay to buy: threads such as the good deals missed and the ones hit are plenty of cases where an item with a value of x has been bought at a half rate or even less.

I've definitely bought some things on there that have been good deals. But I do question it overall with the amount of time I spend on it and how often I didn't get what I expected. There is another Post on here about eBay where I give more details on that. I made a purchase on there tonight (not RPG) that went for less than 10% of normal going rate and even though I sent messages to the seller to let me give him advice on packing the items, he refused and told me he knows what he's doing. Maybe he does and all will be fine, but if he's wrong and they are roughed up in the mail, those items are going to be worth about what I paid for them.

I buy older and very rare items on eBay and it's difficult. I continue to do so because I can't find them locally, but would jump ship in a heartbeat if I could.

Me personally, I'm kind of sick of the "Score" stories, not the ones where somebody found something great that they wanted but the ones where they got something great and paid nothing for it. I don't see it so much on here as the other Collecting and Reselling Groups I'm involved in. I like a deal too, but the things I consider important to me or my collection I gladly paid full price for (and sometimes over).

People want to show how much love they have for something they collect, well pay for it then. Don't tell me you have this great love in collecting something when you'll only pay almost nothing for it. There's plenty of things I wouldn't mind having if it cost me almost nothing.

I picked up a Bowl at Local Auction around last Christmas that was horribly misrepresented, I actually have a working relationship with the place but my Contact was on vacation that week. If I was asked I would have helped them fix their listing but I wasn't so I got to buy it for a steal (8% of normal sale price). This particular item is something I've been looking for for over a decade and it was the first one I'd personally ever seen for sale. I would have paid what it was worth but I didn't have to. I took it to an expert I know to make certain I was caring for it properly and he let the foremost North American Collector of that Bowl know I had one. Turned out it was the only one he was missing, there are more than a dozen variations of it. He asked if I was willing to sell and I said I wasn't looking to but would entertain offers. So he starts lowballing away and telling me how much of a big shot Collector he is and all of the pieces he has and I tell him "I didn't want to sell, that means you need to convince me to. I don't give a rip about your collection or who you are - the only thing you have to get this from me is money and whole lot of it". He didn't get it - my bowl or what I meant.  

I have to source inventory all of the time and people watch Roadshow or hear about all of the "Score" stories, it just makes if harder for me to buy their stuff because everyone is so afraid to be that dummy that did let their stuff go for nothing. Of course, they don't spend a second trying to figure out what it's worth either, so another potential item I could have to make a profit on is still locked in with their owner. Even though they really do want to get rid of it. I seriously blame shows like "Antiques Roadshow" for instilling that fear in them.

Edit - by "nothing" I mean half price or less

aia wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:
The sale option is different but works in a similar way.  Any expert would love to see his items sold at a ten times rate compared to mkt values... Cases of "bid wars" among non experts happens (not in my case unfortunately! ) and this makes ebay attracting...
If an expert has to use a platform where the info is perfectly symmetrical, more or less everybody here would not have any surprise in buying and selling items.  Everything would move at its mkt value without any exciting story and a boring trade to perform.

Actually I see BINs (sale option) for 4-10 times what an item is really worth all over eBay. Some of the time the item is misrepresented or altered but more often it's something that is pretty rare and the seller just waits it out for someone that is impatient or a sucker to come along and buy it. More than a few times, that sucker does come along eventually. I'm in a group of Resellers and a big thing that is taught there is to not use Auction on most items, to wait out that person that will pay more. For many and especially newer items, it's a very effective strategy to use other than just hoping two people will show up and duke it out over your item.

Personally, I just like consistency. High profit sales are nice, but if my customer seriously overpaid on an item and never buys from me again - that's not really a good thing to me. I sell local so my reputation means more than that couple of extra dollars and I depend on referrals too. I'm not as much motivated by money though, I need to make a profit to survive but it's not the most important thing.

rosenkav wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:Well, as I work in marketing, especially digital, and I am quite inside the dot com business, my curiosity is as why there is no alternative to ebay.
What I am seeing is that the big horizontal businesses get clobbered up by more nimble and vertical specialized platforms.
So, it is part curiosity and part professional interest, if you catch my drift

There have been but they always have some weird auction gimmick or some other trick which makes them seem shady. For example, having to pay money to purchase a bid and then using the bids to bid... only to have the system itself capable of upping the number of required bids.

Some are very flash-in-the-pan style sites and then burn out quickly because they don't have inventory (if they are selling themselves) or because they have awful terms and conditions. Amazon could compete but they're more like the eBay store side... no real auctions.

As to why -- maybe anyone who tries would have to be hyper-focused. Doing that, though, means you don't get the mass market, right?

I dunno. I'm sort of out of real collecting.

webrik33 wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:Ebay is what it is. It's just like any other venue, good and bad.

I've been buying and selling as many of us have since it's inception. For the most part, it's been a positive experience in both areas.

I actually enjoy sniping a bid in with 5 seconds to go thinking I'm going to win for sure only to lose to another sniper. It's frustrating but live to fight another day. It's the way the game is. Not to be an ass but if you don't like it, don't play. It's really that simple.

Lots of truth there in a short amount of space.

webrik33 wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:There aren't really any 'mainstream' alternatives to the bay. Etsy I guess if it's still around. I've done the Facebook groups but the prices there seem to be even higher than those on ebay. For the most part. And they are 'cliquish'

Really it's best to deal with members here. You have some of the best collections/collectors on this site, who usually have multiples of items you may be looking for. I've only bought stuff from one member...Toad...and was very pleased with my purchase.

that's just my 2 cents

Thanks for the recommendation. I'll have to keep my eye on the classified section and get a wanted list up on there soon.

ExTSR wrote in Sales and auctions: interested in something else?:Two primary choices nowadays if you use Facebook for auctions, BINs, or trades:

RPGcrate (2359 members, one moderator, no recent growth):
https://www.facebook.com/groups/RPGAuctions/

RolePlayingGamesTradeSell (5,884 members, multiple moderators, growth 1/day):
https://www.facebook.com/groups/rolepla ... tradesell/

I can attest to the large number of quality buyers and sellers on both of these lists. I know many of you avoid Facebook like a plague, but I've had a lot of good experiences buying and selling in these groups.
Also, I would like to plug my own group, TSR Collector's Forum https://www.facebook.com/groups/TSRCollectorsForum.