+thx for clarification
all after black folder are photocopies??

mbassoc2003 wrote:I think there is a lot of evidence that the so called '2nd printing' is actually a print over run from the 1st printing without the black folder. Paper and print quality all appear to be identical. Evidence seems to be that they had more module papers printed than they had folders.

you did read all of previous posts io + tct + tfm??
not identical but yes also not photocopies

mbassoc2003 wrote:Thereafter, I would lend weight to and value to the first printing in digest form, as this coincides with the move to digest for DG and the printing of MI. But to all intent an purposes, everything else in between appear to either legal or counterfeit photocopies, aged anywhere between 20 years old to 20 days old, and you take your chances. Very bad investment for a collector, especially if advances oner the years allo us to determine paper and ink dates.

take a hypothetical item if think for sure was new 30 years ago + know for sure was photocopy as original + believe for sure that original seller had genuine right to be selling then what is problem??
you have good item + up to other people to prove their own are good too
does not matter what method of production is a copy of a copy can still have $$$ value if it is a genuine $1248000 is record for that http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/pcgn/hob_2000.272.htm literally photo copy
if is sudden flood of hightech photocopies or laserprints same thing it is not so much person holding item who has problems it is person who wishes to buy item but does not have. good looking tamo or tsoj not much more difficult to make in 2009 + grid of potvq can be said as better security not worse

ymmv but +thx for discussion for all

mbassoc2003 wrote:Indeed, the printing of the grid I condider to be good security.

As with Tamo etc. again, I give credence and weight to the person I am buying from more so than the item, as can easily be a fake also. Would pay higer to buy from an Acaeum member or known other than a random seller on eBay.

random seller with one or few items someone known to sell copies or refuse scans or to discuss would be more wary yes
still would not put too much trust in acaeum member but weight if can give history or has good research

mbassoc2003 wrote:Indeed, as with all things, the onus is on the buyer to be warey and know about the risks of buying photocopies. Problem here is ALL are photocopies, and as far as I can see, only the presence of a Zocchi sticker can offer a little assurance of age. Even the staicker can be fakes with ease. As I see it, no way of telling old 'authorised' photocopies from later fakes. Way too risky to gamble $100s on, IMO.

for many am sure is true
print run collector wanting likely good copy of distinctive + controversial item before trick of hiding 2009 copies in strata or someone wanting black folder but $1000 too much may still be tempted might think different but is ymmv agree

That's funny?! My friend and I bought the dead sea scrolls from a guy in London back in the early 80's. And I thought we had the only copy.

Nothing here to suppose the LZ photocopy is anything other than a genuine Lou Zocchi Photocopy. Seller doesn't seem switched on enough to print a sticker himself or use a photocopier at Kinkos, so in all likelyhood, the presence of the LZ sticker markes this as a photocopy from Gamescience mande sometime between say 1980 and 1990. Take your pick. Modern reproductions still seem to have a decent market value. Maybe a collector will add this to their ever expanding collection of fakes and photocopies.

   

I never opened it.  The pictures I posted were taken through the baggie, with the pages carefully separated.

You'll have to ask the new owner whether or not he's opened it.  

According to Bella, though, she had like 40 or so additional bagged copies in a box in her garage.

Gotta be the only one we've heard of on a hanger.
Can't seem to find details of it anywhere though?
The hanger makes that one pretty unique, but makes me think, how do you know you have an Orange B3 mint in shrink without actually opening the shrink? But then it wouldn't be mint in shrink?
Remember thinking the cover looked a little odd mind you, like the princess had been misprinted, but without seeing the pictures again, I can't be certain.

bombadil wrote:According to Bella, though, she had like 40 or so additional bagged copies in a box in her garage.

 I missed that...
It wouldn't surprise me.
And wasn't she from Portsmouth or S'hampton?
And don't we know a cat from that neck of the woods?
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .... Makes you wonder, doesn't it?  

Bingo! Look at the figures on the balconies!



One is a Palace of the Vampire Queen, and the other is a Palace of the Vampire Bats!
Did anyone ever track down Yakima Games, and what's the other sticker read?