Those are some fucked-up people, Jason.
It's been my experience that the more deeply religious a person is, the more likely he/she is to attempt to cram their beliefs down others' throats, in whatever way possible. This is a holdover from long ago; organized religions drummed the idea into their followers' heads that they were the "one true religion" and all others had to convert or be lost (or killed). The fundamentals of this are quite sound: successful cults inevitably involve brainwashing the members into thinking they are collectively different in some way, and need to stay together. And after all, any religion is nothing more than a cult.
There's a lot of media play about "radical" Muslims, but the fact of the matter is that the Quran specifically directs Muslims to kill nonbelievers. So does the Bible, although not as openly as the Quran. Ergo, calling a Muslim a "radical" is somewhat redundant. Even if a particular follower doesn't believe in going on jihad every few weeks, he still believes in a doctrine which, at its roots, promotes and encourages hatred and voilence.
Both religions have been responsible for MILLIONS of deaths throughout history.
Organized religion was originally created as a tool to control the minds and actions of others, and it is alive and well today.

Deadlord39 wrote:Both religions have been responsible for MILLIONS of deaths throughout history.
Organized religion was originally created as a tool to control the minds and actions of others, and it is alive and well today.

But then again Stalinism is ALSO responsible for millions of deaths....and in only 50 years of history. Let's don't even get into Mao's "purges".  Religious fanaticism can't be blamed for all the world's massacres.  

I agree with the sentiment....but religions also lead to charities, schools, hospitals and more.  This coming from someone that sets foot in church....well, never.  Ok, weddings and funerals.

The minds at my wife's church may be controlled, but they are motivated towards peaceful and helpful ends.  But you are right the "deeper" someone gets into a religion, the more forceful his/her presentation will be.  Is this just me, or does anyone else notice these types tend to "burn out" in a period of time? I actually know a couple of former hard core holy roller types that are now burnt out, disillusioned, morally bankrupt athiests/agnostics, only decades removed from their glory days.  

Bringing it back to D&D, does anyone else notice that pencil and paper games tend to be overlooked, or considerd "quaint" to those who now spend their fury on violent video games?  Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge"....

Mike B.

Badmike wrote:
But then again Stalinism is ALSO responsible for millions of deaths....and in only 50 years of history. Let's don't even get into Mao's "purges".  Religious fanaticism can't be blamed for all the world's massacres.  

I agree with the sentiment....but religions also lead to charities, schools, hospitals and more.  This coming from someone that sets foot in church....well, never.  Ok, weddings and funerals.

The minds at my wife's church may be controlled, but they are motivated towards peaceful and helpful ends.  But you are right the "deeper" someone gets into a religion, the more forceful his/her presentation will be.  Is this just me, or does anyone else notice these types tend to "burn out" in a period of time? I actually know a couple of former hard core holy roller types that are now burnt out, disillusioned, morally bankrupt athiests/agnostics, only decades removed from their glory days.  

Bringing it back to D&D, does anyone else notice that pencil and paper games tend to be overlooked, or considerd "quaint" to those who now spend their fury on violent video games?  Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge"....

Mike B.

I am always happy to see quality over quantity. D&D will probaly be considered even more suspect and demonic because it requires people to read, and reading has always been the mark of evil.

Badmike wrote:Bringing it back to D&D, does anyone else notice that pencil and paper games tend to be overlooked, or considerd "quaint" to those who now spend their fury on violent video games?  Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge"....

Mike B.

I was always surprised that D&D was the target during the 1980's and games like Call of Cthulhu was ignored.
Of course D&D and role-playing were interchangeable terms during that period.
Anybody reporting on the story probably did not want to complicate the issue for their readers/viewers.

FormCritic wrote:
This is a misunderstanding of some sort.  The Bible does not say that.

Exodus 22:20 "Whoever sacrifices to any god other than the lord must be destroyed."

Acts 3:23 "And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear the prophet, shall be destroyed."

2 Chronicles 15:13 "All who would not seek the lord, the god of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman."

EDIT: Are we off topic enough yet?  

jasonw1239 wrote:
EDIT: Are we off topic enough yet?  

Posts quoting scripture is a good sign that we may need a map and compass to get back to topic .  

The truth is that people have often used religion to advance their own political ecomomic or cultural views - and that has more to do with what they want and less about what a particular interpretation of a religious text or church doctrine. For example; I grew up in Northern Ireland - where what we referred to as the 'troubles' were widely chacterised as a religious war.  BUT that was in fact far from the truth, and the proof of that is that the peace and some measure of agreement which has now been established - was done as a political settlement, without anyone having to swap creed or change their views about transubstantiation.  

red_bus wrote:
Posts quoting scripture is a good sign that we may need a map and compass to get back to topic .  

The truth is that people have often used religion to advance their own political ecomomic or cultural views - and that has more to do with what they want and less about what a particular interpretation of a religious text or church doctrine. For example; I grew up in Northern Ireland - where what we referred to as the 'troubles' were widely chacterised as a religious war.  BUT that was in fact far from the truth, and the proof of that is that the peace and some measure of agreement which has now been established - was done as a political settlement, without anyone having to swap creed or change their views about transubstantiation.  

One of the best lines I heard about religion in Northern Ireland was the tourist that was traveling through who was asked what his religion was.
He said "I am an atheist."
The person who had asked the question thought for a moment and replied "Yes, but are you a Catholic atheist or a Protestant atheist?"  

Atheists may be reviled in some quarters, but I personally believe they have more faith than most people.  And they are usually quite knowledgeable abut all kinds of religious stuff.  Interesting people.

jasonw1239 wrote:Atheism is not a matter of belief or faith.
It is the absence of a belief in the supernatural. Period.  

I have a hard time believing that after talking to many atheists.  They are quite good at outlining what they don't believe and why.  And they are usually quite intelligent...more intelligent than me.  Your definition may be technically correct, but to hear these people speak is quite amazing.  Many have extensive experiences with religion and/or the spiritual which has shaped them.  It is common to find they have rejected religion and it is common to find passion in their convictions.  More passion than many people who state they are believers in one religion or another.

I have also met people who don't believe in much of anything spiritual or religious. They don't call themselves atheists.  For lack of a better word, I call them apathists.  They are simply apathetic about belief.  They are not bad people, they just haven't been around much of anything religious or spiritual.

That's just my experience.