. wrote:UK Convention Copies
Yes, I do know they were 3rd print tower covers, and yes, I conceed that in all likelihood they were legitimate Zocchi released photocopies and not anything sinister or nefarious. Unless we can uncover pother copies, I will presume that these were legitimate an withdraw my original allogation that forgeries were rife in the UK in the 90's. I do find their availability in the early 90's a little strange, but that alone does not amount to substantive proof.

One can still buy "new" 1984 Massconfusion tourneys and Wilmark Dynasty mods in 2009. That's a rather longer stretch than PotVQ to the late 1980s or early 1990s and, for that UK source, a closed FLGS still feels like a better explanation than "brand new stock" into the country direct from Lou.

. wrote:TFM's Bastard 2nd Print
I would tend to defer to Kynan's knowledge and 'feel' for what is real and what is not; for what is modern and what is old. His base material for comparison is far greater than many's and his experience is also far greater than most. If his opinion is that it was produced late 80's or early 90's, and that is in comparison to know products in his possession, then that is a far better evaluation than any I've heard on Acaeum. That makes it either a Zocchi printed some 10+ years AFTER the supposed date of publication, and that requires explanation if it is to be believed genuine. I would suggest that this copy is genuine and indeed printed as a means of getting a quick buck far later than Zocchi's agreement with WW intended.

I'd be inclined to file that with "UK Convention Copies", above, given the source location and (estimated) date. Ten years is still a guess and could just as easily be mid-80s or possibly earlier unless there's something that really indicates otherwise in the paper.
I did offer Kynan his full purchase price plus all shipping costs as soon as he declared that to be a modern fake (heavily-rusted staple and all), and he decided otherwise.

Thanks for withdrawing that overarching "rife with forgeries" implication for the time being. Not that it's not possible that there are some around, but evidence of such to any degree amongst those seen-later/believed-later copies - of which we have a grand total of one (Zocchi), at present - still hasn't been provided.

I'd still like to know if those staples are curled or flat. Were they put in by hand and not a machine? Is there staple rust on the cardboard? Are there indentations where the staples used to be curled? All these things will thell you if that ziploc and hanger were added later.

 

I seem to remember typed manuscripts, a Gideon business card, an original Tegel, a copy of White Dwarf 1, maybe some geos and some other JG crap? Did these things get sold in other sales? I though it was one huge job lot.

That description to me sounds like a hand priced item at $3.95 was subsequently increased in price to $5.00 with the addition of a new sticler over the old. Either as a result of shops increasing their price over time, or as a result of the exchange of stock from one seller to another.

I'd like to see close upd of the staples on the front and the back. Curious about staple rust transference to the card, and whether the staples were inserted by a stapler or by hand. Also curios about the choice of the card header. Looks likt the type of card you get on the ack of a jotter. Would have expected something more refined for a shop packaging it's own products. Certainly would have expected LZ or TSR to have placed their own information on the cardboard header if they had shipped it.

afoolandhis$ wrote:Of course, the fact that the "hanger" is blank doesn't rule out the possibility that the item came direct from WW or even TSR in its baggy, and that Yakima Games just slapped a hanger on it themselves.

I'd be pretty sure the hanger was a local production: our FLGSs did that all the time to improve display space usage, keep stock in sight(!) and try to save it from excessive mangling.

Found a couple more Zocchi catalogs both from 1980 (Feb and Fall).  Both list PotVQ at $4.50 and describe it as:

A Dungeon Master's Kit for people who haven't the time or experience needed to make up an original dungeon.  The kit has 5 levels of her palace with secret rooms, secret doors, etc. and ten sheets for the Dungeon Master, which list all the treasures and creatures to be found in each room.

Also for sale are Banner of Chaos $3, Character Archaic $4.50, Dog Tags $3, Dungeon Designer's Kit $4.75, Dwarven Glory $4.50, Endless Dungeon $4.50, Game Designer's Kit $6.50, Labyrinthine $4.50, Misty Isles $5, PotVQ $4.50, and Vanquished Foe $4.50.

Mars wrote:Found a couple more Zocchi catalogs both from 1980 (Feb and Fall).  Both list PotVQ at $4.50 and describe it as:



Also for sale are Banner of Chaos $3, Character Archaic $4.50, Dog Tags $3, Dungeon Designer's Kit $4.75, Dwarven Glory $4.50, Endless Dungeon $4.50, Game Designer's Kit $6.50, Labyrinthine $4.50, Misty Isles $5, PotVQ $4.50, and Vanquished Foe $4.50.

Is it too late to order?

. wrote:Don't you just wish you could still buy those.
Maybe Zocchi's still got boxes in his warehouse. Or would reprint if enough people asked him to.

They are probably right up there with buying the R and RPGA modules from TSR for 2 for $8 in the late 80s.

I was trying to follow the Zocchi trail for a while.  Zocchi distribution was sold to Mike Hurdle in 1996 and then possibly bought by SyCoNet.com in the early 2000s.

http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/press/press.1474.html

Although it seems like Zocchi distribution closed its doors shortly after 911 at the end of 2001 and had a pretty nice blow out sale.

http://www.icv2.com/articles/home/877.html