Traveller wrote:Want the whole picture? A good place to start is Troll & Toad's financial statements, which should be a matter of public record since those statements have to be filed with the state they operate the business out of. From there, you should be able to deduce just how well they have been satisfying their customer base in general. If things are truly as bad as the negative posts claim, then Troll & Toad's sales figures for this time of year compared to last should be in the red. I suspect though they're in the black.

i'd be pretty interested in seeing these statements.  unfortunately they're a private company, and i don't think they have to disclose their financial statements.  (a quick search on sec.gov didn't turn up anything)

dsaunders wrote:i'd be pretty interested in seeing these statements.  unfortunately they're a private company, and i don't think they have to disclose their financial statements.  (a quick search on sec.gov didn't turn up anything)

Then without being able to see both sides of the equation, you'll never get an accurate assessment as to the ratio of satisfied customers versus dissatisfied ones. Saying "Troll & Toad is bad" based on only negative customer comments is shortsighted and misleading. Especially when Troll & Toad themselves acknowledge that there are issues they need to resolve.

I highly doubt that Troll & Toad's customer satisfaction rate is so abysmal that they're going under anytime soon. Based on something I've heard from people more skilled in management than I, 91% of their customers walk away happy with their purchase, or in slightly different terms, for every complaint received there are 10 happy customers who don't comment. A- customer service is ok, but Troll & Toad can improve that number simply by making sure they spend the time to take photos and spend the time to make accurate descriptions of their products. And, of course, putting the customer first.

You might consider the one visible factor:  Do they stay in business?

serleran wrote:I think I understand the "cannot upload images" to the website thing... it seems trollandtoad.com is a GoDaddy registered site. I believe they impose limitations and so forth...

I'd suggest self-hosting.

I think their problems stem from this:

Our website design and database is maintained by ESG Digital Solutions, an international IT solutions company headquartered in Istanbul, Turkey. They are located at http://www.esg.com.tr/eng/

FormCritic wrote:Do they stay in business?

It wasn't that long ago, iirc, that Jon built a new facility to handle the size & growth.

There is no doubt they stay in business, and there is no doubt they have a business model that works. Plenty of businesses succeed in a similar manner, and I don't believe anyone has a God given right to be told the truth, not milead, or treated well.

Misleading customers and exagerating the condition and completeness of products are perfectly valid business tactics. Maybe not moral, but if it earns you money, who gives a F?

By the same account, I work in the construction industry in the UK, and I have seen some of the most horrificly incompetent work by subcontractors, just covered up and burried on the grounds that it's done and it earns money, get the building complete and after a year it's a latent defect and who gives a F after that. Perfectly acceptable business practice if you want to run a building company in the UK.

But...

The thread is about people who are complaining about T&T, their complaints, and T&T's responses to those. Not about what constitutes acceptable corners that can be cut to run a business.

At the end of the day, the customer who gets hoodwinked, screwed, mislead, duped, or just feels like he's lost out, only have themselves to blame. Like being an idiot and walking around on a motorway, you can't really complain if you get hit, when you know damn well what T&T are like and their business practaces.

My only real issue is that T&T continue to feed the forum bull about their reason for conducting themselves this way. If they were honest and said, "You know what, we're happy dealing with people this way, 'cos there's always someone who'll buy, and wh've proven it. If you don't want to buy, don't. If you want to roll the dice and take your chance, go for it.", at least there is integrity and honesty in saying so. As a business it works, and you can't flaw it.

Maybe the real problem are the people who buy, and then whinge about it afterwards.

That's good old Troll & Toad honesty.

ashmire13 wrote:Probably a simple answer, but why do so many ebay auctions finish early, despite not finishing with BIN?

Things get removed due to private sales off eBay. Majority of cases.
Things get 'lost' or 'damaged'.
People change their minds and decide not to sell. Yeah right!
Only one incident I can remember in 6 years where there's been a server clock problem and 90% of the buyers got the wrong end time and error messages, but that was a few minutes.

Simple answer then

Although the same two items are back on ebay!